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• View topic - help with my final thesis: frilled headwear in france

help with my final thesis: frilled headwear in france

Moderator: Johan Sjöberg

help with my final thesis: frilled headwear in france

Postby Isis » 15 Feb 2009, 13:44

Hi all!

As some of you may know, last year I wrote my bachelor-paper on frilled headwear in the Low Countries from ca. 1350 to 1500.
I made an inventory of artwork and archeological finds showing frilled headwear from this region (over 160 items are in it) and a typology of the different variations in frilled headwear.

For my final thesis I'm continuing on the same subject, but it wil also cover the period of ca. 1250 to 1350. I will place the Flemish and Dutch frilled veils in an international context and research the social context in which they were used.
I will also focus on the construction of the frilled veils and on the arrangement of the veils (understructures, fastening aids like pins and the like, caps and hairnets underneath the veils, etc...).

For the international context I am looking for pictorial evidence of frilled headwear in France. If any of you knows examples please let me know!

Also, if you would like to see my bachelor-paper you can pm me. It is in Dutch though, but it has images ;)
I do not have time to do an English translation at present, but I really do want to do one in the future.

Cheers,
Isis
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Re: help with my final thesis: frilled headwear in france

Postby Peter » 15 Feb 2009, 20:38

Hey Isis.

I went through my collection of French sources, about a thousand or so, but I didn't find a single frilled veil. Strange, and very interesting. Do you have the same experience?
Mordlysten krigsman, rå och hård i hjertat,
Och med ett samvete som helvet rymligt,
Skall rasa fritt med blodbestänkta händer
Och meja edra friska jungfrur af
Och edra fagra spenabarn som gräs
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Peter
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Location: Kävlinge, Sweden

Re: help with my final thesis: frilled headwear in france

Postby Isis » 15 Feb 2009, 23:16

thank you so much for the effort peter! you're a darling!

in my experience they are hard to find in france. let's say I have about 5 examples of french frilled veils, one of which one manuscript that includes several depictions of the veils.
Auteur/Titre : guillaume de machaut
Nom de pays : france
Origine : reims
Siècle : 14ème siècle
Date : vers 1372-1377

Here are links to the images:
Français 1584, fol. 91v, Amantes : les déloyales

Français 1584, fol. 91v, Amantes : les loyales

Français 1584, fol. 175v, Allégorie : Harpe moralisée

Français 1584, fol. 177v, Machaut et sa dame

Français 1584, fol. 248, Machaut et sa dame

Français 1584, fol. 259v, Machaut et Bon Espoir


but then, I have never really focused on french costume. so I just one to make sure I'm not missing any important examples!!

there are also some examples from places that are now in france, but were in the middle ages part of the of County of Flanders.

so if anyone has anything that'd be great! and if no one knows anything, that may just confirm that frilled veils were simply very rare in France.
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Re: help with my final thesis: frilled headwear in france

Postby Isis » 15 Feb 2009, 23:45

Astrid (she is also on this forum) sent me this a couple of days ago:

She wrote to me:
"I do not have an exact date for it, but as far as I remember it was around 1370, Northern France."

Does anyone know this image and where it comes from?
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Re: help with my final thesis: frilled headwear in france

Postby Peter » 16 Feb 2009, 09:22

Argh!

I have that manuscript myself! I must have been really tired :oops:

What regards the pic from Astrid - I haven't seen that manuscript myself. Astrid - do you have any more pics from it?
Mordlysten krigsman, rå och hård i hjertat,
Och med ett samvete som helvet rymligt,
Skall rasa fritt med blodbestänkta händer
Och meja edra friska jungfrur af
Och edra fagra spenabarn som gräs
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Peter
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Posts: 2543
Joined: 23 Feb 2008, 02:03
Location: Kävlinge, Sweden

Re: help with my final thesis: frilled headwear in france

Postby Astrid » 16 Feb 2009, 10:56

Unfortunately not.

I have found this picture somewhere in the web, but originally saved it for the belt makers booth and not for the ladies :oops:
I just detected later on that one of them had a frilled veil...

But do you know the "Institut für Realienkunde" of the Austrian Library?

Try this link: http://www.imareal.oeaw.ac.at/realonline/

There are thousands of digital pictures!

If there are language problems - just ask me...
- the hanseatic merchant's wife -
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Re: help with my final thesis: frilled headwear in france

Postby Bertus Brokamp » 16 Feb 2009, 11:12

Interesting to note is that the belt/pursemaker in this instance also seems to sell targes. As many shields seem to have had a sort of leather covering, this sort of makes sense.
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Re: help with my final thesis: frilled headwear in france

Postby Peter » 16 Feb 2009, 11:45

Astrid: I always try to use IMAREAL, but I don't manage to get much out of it. The user interface sucks if you ask me, and my German isn't smashing enough to decode everything. When I search fpr stuff 1350-1400, I don't come up with much. Do you have any ideas how to make it a better search?
Mordlysten krigsman, rå och hård i hjertat,
Och med ett samvete som helvet rymligt,
Skall rasa fritt med blodbestänkta händer
Och meja edra friska jungfrur af
Och edra fagra spenabarn som gräs
User avatar
Peter
Styrelse
 
Posts: 2543
Joined: 23 Feb 2008, 02:03
Location: Kävlinge, Sweden

Re: help with my final thesis: frilled headwear in france

Postby Astrid » 16 Feb 2009, 11:49

Why don't we get on the phone and try to work out something together?
I will let you have my phone number by separate e-mail.
- the hanseatic merchant's wife -
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Location: Hamburg, Germany

Re: help with my final thesis: frilled headwear in france

Postby Louise » 16 Feb 2009, 12:09

The stand is really great too - another source to that. :)

It sounds really interesting with your final thesis, Isis. Good luck with your work and I´m really looking forward to reading more about the veils.
Louise
 

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